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Geert Wilders’ speaking tour

Dutch MP Geert Wilders. Photo: AFP

Dutch MP Geert Wilders. Photo: AFP

My friends form the left seem to be utterly terrified that this man will shatter their delusions about the nature of Islam and I just can’t help thinking that this fear is an example of a the sort of intestinal fortitude deficit that saw Neville Chamberlain declare that there would be “peace in our time” just prior to WW2. If a man receives death threats and requires substantial and constant protective efforts to ensure he remains alive isn’t that an indictment of the faith that he criticises and proof that it is no religion of peace?

click for source

click for source

I expect that the marriage of convenience between minions of the left and Islam will manifest itself in the form of claims the Geert is a “racist” and an Islamophobe (cue: Damian Doyle)but I can’t see such claims as anything other than those same minions being willing butt boys for a religion that is antithetical to all of their claimed belief in the rights of the individual to the inalienable right to autonomy of thought and a right to criticise all religious dogma. The left are total quislings when it comes to any criticism of the ideology of Islam they have been utterly cowered by the threats of violence, both explicit but more from the implicit threats that the promised violence that has been focused upon Wilders will be visited upon any here who speak up against the “religion of peace”.
Its all well and good to be tolerant of all of the many ways that people seek to personify the deity but in my view our obligation to be tolerant ends the moment that followers of any faith threaten or visit violence upon their critics.

Cheers Comrades

warningmuslimsnearby-vi

I also note that there will be no Brisbane appearance, which is very disappointing to me personally…

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66 Comments

  1. Ray Dixon says:

    Wilders can only speak for Holland and really has no business going on ‘tour’ in Australia lecturing us about the ‘evils of Islam’. What happens in overcrowded Europe is practically of no relevance over here. Europe has always been a minefield of racial and national tensions …. for thousands of years, Iain …. and wars. Ask yourself this:

    If Islam were as big a problem in Australia as you make it out to be, how is it that you haven’t received any death threats despite running an ongoing vilification campaign and calling for a halt to all muslim immigration, much like Wilders has, these past 8 years? Okay, you’re not a politician but your blog is widely read on the Internet and I’m sure would have come under notice by all kinds of muslims. Any fatwas or death threats against you these past 8 years, Iain? (Apart from the one on SW, but that was made by an Aussie).

  2. Iain Hall says:

    Ray
    You are right that I have not as yet received explicit death threats, however the experience of other critics of Islam both here and overseas do add up to enough of an implicit threat for anyone like me to think twice about giving voice to their concerns about this religion. You see the experience in Europe is not unique at all and its very likely to be repeated here if and when there are similar demographics here. In fact that is one of the reasons that I think that raising our voices now is important. If we make it clear that we are not going to tolerate the intimidation from Islamic nutters now while their numbers are small then we stand a chance of avoiding the problems being experienced all over Europe in our near future.

  3. Ray Dixon says:

    When have we ever followed Europe in regards to race/religious/political matters, Iain? How many wars have we had on this continent compared to the continent of Europe? The experience in Europe certainly is pretty unique – so unique that it doesn’t even seem to penetrate to any great degree just 50 kms across the English channel, even though the muslim population there is much higher than Australia’s. And even though England has a long history of race/religious/political wars among its own people. Apart from the sureveillance and undercover work being conducted on the few militants and the underground bombing about a decade ago, where is this war between England & Islam? It’s a blip on the radar compared to the wars and ongoing tensions with Ireland. All Wilders will achieve in Australia is to stir up fears.

  4. Iain Hall says:

    The experiences of those who live in western Sydney suggests that you are wrong here Ray. We may not have problems of the magnitude of those in Europe yet but its foolish to suggest that it won’t happen here if the demographic trends evident in Europe are repeated here.

  5. Grace says:

    Wake up Ray, based on a per head of population we are reaching a level playing field and in the not to distant future could over take Europe.
    There’s a lesson to be learnt from what they have and are facing over there, and if you choose to wear blinkers well that’s your choice, but that doesn’t mean the rest of us have to just sit back and let our country be over-run, go down the plug hole for a group of people who’s religion is promoted as the religion of peace, yet their religious leaders preach hatred and violence.

  6. Ray Dixon says:

    based on a per head of population we are reaching a level playing field and in the not to distant future could over take Europe (in numbers of muslims)

    And yet there are no signs here of any real problems. So you’re proposing what exactly, banning further muslim immigration? What about the ones already here, won’t they ‘breed like rabbits’ and then we’ll be “over-run and go down the plug hole” anyway? What do you think might be the implications of Australia discriminating like that? Go on, I’m interested to know how far you’ve thought this through – so we ban muslims … what happens then?

  7. Brian says:

    Ah, another day, another Islam-threatens-our-way-of-life post from Iain. No doubt “GD”, Fiona and others will be along shortly.

    I’m not sure I can be bothered commenting too much on this, except to say that there looks to be something very “Mars Attacks” about Geert Wilder’s head.

  8. Iain Hall says:

    Actually Brian this is a post about the way that so may of the minions of the left are scared to allow any criticism of Islam lest Muslims are offended even when Muslims make no actual complaint.

  9. deknarf says:

    I’m not terrified. The guy is just a racist nitwit!

  10. Maybe Muslim fundamentalists have a point: perhaps we’re too dogmatic about our beliefs in freedom and secularism 😛 . It might be a good idea to consider living under a Muslim Caliphate and threatening all others who disagree with us…. (That was sarcasm by the way).

  11. Grace says:

    Well Brian, you know the old saying, Too Much Of A Good Thing, well I think we are reaching that point, we’ve been getting too much of a, well something and it’s not a good thing, especially during the past 12 months and it’s time to put the brakes on.
    This I can say in Australia and if someone wants to come here and tell us about there experiences with a problem overseas, I say lets listen.

  12. Brian says:

    Oh I have no problem with Wilders coming here to express his paranoid views and carry on like a pork chop. That is his fundamental right and I would never deny it to him.

  13. Ray Dixon says:

    So I take it you won’t/can’t answer my question, Grace?

  14. Grace says:

    Yes Ray ban the dam lot of them and stop the rot simple. Show the rest of the world that we are prepared to take the lead and not end up for instance like France and the huge problems it now faces because at one stage they were do gooders and left the flood gates open.

  15. Richard Ryan says:

    Wilders has that same smug smirk on his platter as has Bolt. Is this a Dutch Genetic trait?

  16. GD says:

    Are you being racist Richard?

  17. Brian says:

    Sounds good Grace. Of course there’ll be a global backlash against us. We’ll get flogged in the UN, in the global media and especially by Islamic countries. We’ll be a pariah state, viewed as racist, xenophobic and unwilling to accept refugees and immigrants. There’ll be sanctions, embargoes and massive declines in trade. Tourists, musicians and sporting teams won’t want to come here. Our already gasping economy will very quickly start to choke, affecting living standards and the future of our (non-Muslim) children.

    But if you can put up with all of that, then no problem.

  18. Brian says:

    Oh, but if the one’s here are breeding too quickly, we’ll need to do something about them too. Maybe pass laws removing them from the civil service. Make them wear armbands with crescents or cartoons of Mohammad. Bring in guidelines to we know exactly who is and who isn’t Muslim (we’ll call them the Bundaberg Laws). Maybe round them up and put them into big camps. How’s all that sounding Grace?

  19. GD says:

    Brian panicked:

    there’ll be a global backlash against us. We’ll get flogged in the UN, in the global media and especially by Islamic countries. We’ll be a pariah state, viewed as racist, xenophobic and unwilling to accept refugees and immigrants. There’ll be sanctions, embargoes and massive declines in trade. Tourists, musicians and sporting teams won’t want to come here. Our already gasping economy will very quickly start to choke, affecting living standards and the future of our (non-Muslim) children.

    Brian may I suggest you’re sounding a little hysterical.

    Australia is one of the more generous countries in regards to immigration. A global backlash? I doubt it. Flogged in the UN? Who cares? Gillard just gave them millions, they’re not going to complain. And why should we be concerned about Islamic countries disapproving of our immigration policy?

    There’ll be sanctions, embargoes and massive declines in trade.

    Really? So we are being coerced to import bludging immigrants from failed Middle Eastern countries to maintain our trade figures?

    I thought Australia’s economy was doing really well, according to your leader Wayne Swan, it is. So apparently it’s not? Pray tell.

    And this pearler:

    Tourists, musicians and sporting teams won’t want to come here.

    Are you serious? How many burqa clad tourists have you seen in your part of town? If you’ve even seen one, you can be sure she is on the way to Centrelink.

    Musicians? How many Islamic musicians have toured here. The Koran frowns on music and dancing.

    Sporting teams? Hmm, not many Islamic women’s sports teams in international competition.

    Perhaps you mean sporting teams, tourists and musicians from other cultures. I doubt they will single out Australia for castigation, given that Islam dishes out far more discrimination, prejudice and hatred than any other culture on Earth.

    Brian you have gone from being an apologist for Islam to being a bleeding heart for Islam. In years to come, the Islamists won’t thank you, and neither will us Aussies.

    You should be ashamed.

  20. Ray Dixon says:

    Seriously, GD, you think we could ban migrants of a certain faith or ethnicity without serious repercussions? You think other nations of the world and their citizens would accept our ‘right’ to discriminate and continue to deal with us as if nothing had changed? You think that the majority of Australians would be comfortabe with that and there’d be no civil unrest and mass protests? You think this’d be a good thing for the country because otherwise it would “go down the plug hole”? Seriously?

  21. Ray Dixon says:

    And Grace, you still didn’t answer my question. I already knew you want to ban muslims entering Australia but what I asked you is what do you think the implications might be? Brian gave his response (which is a hell of a lot more accurate than GD’s), what’s yours? Please – you can’t just bellyache and not have a plan. Got one?

  22. Grace says:

    GD I think you are spot on.
    Implications? Well the bleeding heart Islamic extremists would shout foul, you no doubt would join them and the majority of the Australian population would rejoice. Those from overseas who cry aren’t worth listening too and we would be applauded by those who are seeking a reprieve from invasion by stealth.
    Today we read where there’s an upping on the numbers of Islamics being sent to Tasmania, Tasmania which has just had a large part of it’s economy devastated by bushfires and the Greens wiping out to a large extent it’s major industry, forestry and milling. Yet idiots from the Labor government are sending, quote to be integrated into the Tasmanian community these people who will find work and create a new life for themselves.
    That’s just fairyland stuff. There are genuine Australians who are now at a loss for work and work prospects, these are Australians who speak English, unlike the majority of the imports, where’s the sense in that.
    Then we have second and third generation freeloaders like this wonderful example;

    “Life on the pension is a riot for Omar ”

    HE has no trouble smashing police car windscreens with milk crates but it seems Muslim rioter Omar Halaby is not fit to work, receiving a $200-a-fortnight disability support pension.

    The 19-year-old from Padstow last week escaped with a good-behaviour bond for his role in September’s violent Muslim protest in the CBD – partly because of remorse, his previous clean record and health issues he suffers that include sporting injuries and literacy problems.

    When The Daily Telegraph visited his home yesterday, Halaby did not wish to talk about his reasons for claiming the pension. His father also refused to comment.

    In documents tendered to the Downing Centre Local Court, Legal Aid lawyer Sophie Edin said Halaby suffered from “certain disabilities” which had seen him claim the pension for the past three years.”He has some physical problems in relation to some football accidents,” Ms Edin told the court. “He has literacy issues, a short attention span, things to that effect.”

    Community Services Minister Jenny Macklin yesterday defended the eligibility criteria of the disability support pension, which can be paid up to a rate of $712 a fortnight, compared to the dole at $492.

    A spokeswoman for Ms Macklin said recipients were forced to meet strict criteria to claim the disability pension.

    “People do not qualify for the disability support pension because they are illiterate,” the spokeswoman said. “To be eligible for the disability support pension a person must have a permanent disability or medical conditions that make them unable to work.”

    About 820,000 people are on the disability pension, costing $15 billion a year, which is predicted to balloon to $16.9 billion by 2015-16.

    Halaby lives with his parents but, according to court documents, pays no board from his $200-a-fortnight taxpayer-funded allowance. He is not involved in any studies or community organisations, the documents said.

    In court, Halaby said he was sorry for his actions and confirmed he had paid compensation to the police for the smashed windscreen.

    Muslim community leader Keysar Trad said he was not aware of the nature of Halaby’s disability but claimed it was often difficult for Muslims to find employment, even if they were able-bodied.

    “If you have any name that is Middle Eastern or Islamic, you’ll often find you don’t get past the interview stage,” Mr Trad said.

    “We encourage all people to find gainful employment to both contribute to society and to improve their skills, but sometimes that is harder for Muslim people.”

    He said the riots were an “ugly time in our history”.

    But he said Muslim community leaders had taken steps to prevent a repeat of such a disgraceful episode.

    http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/life-on-the-pension-is-a-riot-for-omar/story-e6freuy9-1226558635258

    WELL DONE OMAR….

  23. Iain Hall says:

    Ray & Brian
    There are lots of countries who make it very difficult for non citizens to settle or acquire citizenship, Japan is a notable example and they do not suffer a “backlash” for protecting the nature of their society. Further many of the Islamic states are very nasty indeed to non Muslims either treating them like dirt or banning then altogether, how many Jews will you find in Saudi Arabia for instance? Now when migration from such places is in fairly small numbers those and when individual were expected to assimilate there was less of a problem but under the ghettoising policies of multiculturalism there is a tendency to recreate a microcosm of the very same Islamic societies that many of the immigrants have fled.This is not so good for host countries like us.
    Finally on the possible damage to tourism, Think of Bhutan where entry is extremely restricted, and tourists are desperate to visit it none the less.

  24. Ray Dixon says:

    Grace, there are also many Aussie born bludgers on welfare committing anti-social crimes like (or worse than) Omar’s. The slant and amount of space the DT has given that article is only because he’s a muslim. The reason you’ve quoted it is also only because he’s a muslim. It’s called cherry picking to suit your argument. As for Tasmania, the fires were large but they hardly “devastated a large part of the State’s economy”.

    the majority of the Australian population would rejoice. Those from overseas who cry aren’t worth listening too and we would be applauded by those who are seeking a reprieve from invasion by stealth.

    Thank Christ the majority of Australians are not as extreme and bigoted as you are. Do you really like being such a bigot? I get the impression that if there were no muslims in Australia you’d move on to the next ethnic or religious group. Gotta have someone to blame and hate, eh?

  25. Ray Dixon says:

    So come out and say it then, Iain: You want a full ban on all muslim immigration, right? Do you also want to deport existing ones? Or would they just be rounded up and detained? Come on, be clear – is that what you’re advocating, Iain? I think you’ve got a bit more nous about this than GD (and certainly a lot more than Grace!) and you realise it’s totally impractical and unacceptable to ban migrants on the basis of their faith/ethnicity. But you need to say it.

  26. Iain Hall says:

    Ray

    So come out and say it then, Iain: You want a full ban on all Muslim immigration, right?

    As you well know I think that we should drastically reduce all immigration in favour of “growing our own” Aussies .

    Do you also want to deport existing ones?

    Only if they take up Jihad.

    Or would they just be rounded up and detained?

    If they respect our laws and expections of civil behaviour then the answer is a definite No.

    Come on, be clear – is that what you’re advocating, Iain?

    NO it is NOT what I’m advocating.

    I think you’ve got a bit more nous about this than GD (and certainly a lot more than Grace!) and you realise it’s totally impractical and unacceptable to ban migrants on the basis of their faith/ethnicity. But you need to say it.

    There is no reason to cite religion in particular when the minister already has an ability to reject individual non citizens on the basis that they are not of good character, frankly those who subscribe to a pernicious Jihadist ideology should fail to get over the universal good character test.

  27. Ray Dixon says:

    Putting aside your over simplistic and economically retrograde views on reducing overall immigration, Iain, and your unsubstantiated belief that ‘growing our own’ somehow produces better citizens – hey, go to the local shopping mall and see the types who are ‘growing our own’ on the $5,000 baby bonus – that’s ptretty much a fence-sitting response. And this ….

    those who subscribe to a pernicious Jihadist ideology should fail to get over the universal good character test.

    …. is unworkable. What do you propose, that as well as passing tests on Australian history, social norms, culture and functions-of-govt (that many ‘home growns’ would fail, btw), new arrivals should also be asked this:

    Do you believe in Jihad? Yes/No
    Do you support the 9/11 terrorist act? Yes/No
    Do you support the Bali bombings? Yes/No
    Do you plan to become a terrorist in Australia? Yes/No
    Is it your desire for Australia to become an Islamic State subject to Sharia law? Yes/No.

    It might catch a few out, Iain, but seriously ………………….

  28. Iain Hall says:

    Ray
    Growing our own has a number of economic advantages, firstly it will provide employment to teachers and carers but more importantly It will give those new Aussies a chance to be inculcated with the social values that we find beneficial, frankly you don’t have to look far in some of the current immigration source countries to find some rather nasty examples of rather nasty ideology ( for example the anti-Semitism in the Muslim Diaspora is not something we should be importing)For all of your disdain for the “Bogan” the majority of those do have a rather fierce, if simplistic, sort of patriotism for Australia which I would rate as being preferable to a desire for martyrdom and Jihad.
    I suspect that your whole belief in immigration is rooted in your belief that all economic growth is good, well I am more certain that there is good growth and not so good growth. Growing our own may give us slower and more modest growth but I also think that it would give us a better society in the long run and isn’t that what we both want?

  29. Ray Dixon says:

    I suspect that your whole belief in immigration is rooted in your belief that all economic growth is good

    No, Iain, Australia is not yet at that critical mass where we can scale back immigration. Yes, of course I want a strong economy but you won’t get one by waiting 20, 30 or more years for the current crop of home grown babies to grow up and start contributing to it. We’d go “down the plug hole” waiting.

  30. Brian says:

    Brian may I suggest you’re sounding a little hysterical.

    That’s rich coming from you, who cries Muslims-in-my-suburb every time you post here.

    I’m not at all hysterical or even concerned about Australia being made a pariah state because of its immigration policies, because I know that it will never happen. Whether the country is run by Labor or Liberal, it’s in the hands of smarter people than you. Banning all Muslim immigration will never be seriously considered. I was simply outlining some of the effects if we were ever stupid enough to follow yours and Grace’s advice.

    And I wasn’t talking about Muslim tourists and musicians not coming here, you thickhead. If we acquire an international reputation as a racist nation, far fewer people of ANY nationality or ethnicity will want to come here. We’ll be the rotten fish down under and people will start going to New Zealand instead. But that’s not the reason why banning all Muslim immigration is the wrong idea… it’s the wrong idea simply because it’s wrong. It’s only acceptable to people who are bigots, xenophobes or scared out of their little minds.

    Brian you have gone from being an apologist for Islam to being a bleeding heart for Islam.

    I am no such thing, as should be obvious to those who are capable of reading and comprehension. I know this discounts you.

    There are lots of countries who make it very difficult for non citizens to settle or acquire citizenship, Japan is a notable example.

    Iain, Japan is full to bursting and hardly capable of taking any immigrants. It is hard for any non-Japanese to emigrate there; they don’t discriminate on the basis of race or religion. As for Saudi Arabia and Bhutan, I’m not sure anyone actually wants to emigrate to either of those countries, so the point is moot. We are a large and affluent multicultural country with tons of space. People want to come and live here. Shutting our borders to some on the grounds of race and religion would not only be prejudiced, it would be cutting our own throat.

  31. Iain Hall says:

    Brian

    Iain, Japan is full to bursting and hardly capable of taking any immigrants.

    That is not what My Nephew who is married to a Japanese woman tells about the place he lives in.

    It is hard for any non-Japanese to emigrate there; they don’t discriminate on the basis of race or religion.

    Strangely that is what I’m suggesting for this country 😉

    As for Saudi Arabia and Bhutan, I’m not sure anyone actually wants to emigrate to either of those countries, so the point is moot.

    My point is not about the desire of anyone to move there, rather it was to point out that countries being very restrictive about immigration is not that unusual

    We are a large and affluent multicultural country with tons of space. People want to come and live here. Shutting our borders to some on the grounds of race and religion would not only be prejudiced, it would be cutting our own throat.

    The amount of “space” we have is not the issue Brian when you consider other resources like potable water and our largely unspoilt environment you have to consider a rather different criteria about our ideal population.Especially if we don’t want to fuck this place up in the same way that the more crowded countries have fucked up their environmentans.

  32. Brian says:

    That is not what My Nephew who is married to a Japanese woman tells about the place he lives in.

    Strange, because my son taught English in Japan for two years and he reckons the place is choked with people. I don’t think anyone could dispute the fact that Japan’s population density is one of the highest in the world.

    Strangely that is what I’m suggesting for this country

    We are a country of 20 million on a vast island continent and you want to shut the doors? How bizarre.

    My point is not about the desire of anyone to move there, rather it was to point out that countries being very restrictive about immigration is not that unusual

    I realise that, however I think the issue of immigration policy and immigration desirability are essentially linked. It doesn’t matter one iota whether Robert Mugabe has an open door policy or blocks entry to everyone, because nobody wants to live in Zimbabwe. The same applies to Saudi Arabia (a quasi-fascist theocracy) and Bhutan (a nice place to visit but nobody wants to live there).

    The amount of “space” we have is not the issue Brian when you consider other resources like potable water and our largely unspoilt environment you have to consider a rather different criteria about our ideal population.

    Iain I reckon Australia could double its population within ten years and provided they didn’t all cling to the major cities and the coastline, we’d have no major issues. Water is a problem that can be managed with infrastructure developments. Haven’t you heard we’ve got a big desal plant going spare down here, thanks to Steve Brackish and John Bumbly?

    Especially if we don’t want to fuck this place up in the same way that the more crowded countries have fucked up their environmentans.

    That’s odd, I never picked you for a Greenie!

  33. Tel says:

    I’m not at all hysterical or even concerned about Australia being made a pariah state because of its immigration policies, because I know that it will never happen.

    Because China isn’t known for taking the self-defeating moral high ground on their iron and coal purchases. They will of course, buy oil from Iran in the same afternoon, and that’s Capitalism for you… unstoppable as a Cat bulldozer.

  34. Tel says:

    Seriously, GD, you think we could ban migrants of a certain faith or ethnicity without serious repercussions?

    Oh they would steadfastly refuse to buy our wheat, our rice, our beef, our lamb and our sugar. I really respect anyone willing to starve themselves and their family for the sake of a principle. Or I would do, if I ever met someone like that.

  35. Iain Hall says:

    Brian

    Strange, because my son taught English in Japan for two years and he reckons the place is choked with people. I don’t think anyone could dispute the fact that Japan’s population density is one of the highest in the world.

    I was not suggesting that Japan does not have a high population density only that there are cultural rather than space reason’s for the Japanese aversion to immigrants

    Strangely that is what I’m suggesting for this country

    We are a country of 20 million on a vast island continent and you want to shut the doors? How bizarre.

    Why is it so bizarre to want any population increase to be gradual and from our loins rather than our ports?

    I realise that, however I think the issue of immigration policy and immigration desirability are essentially linked. It doesn’t matter one iota whether Robert Mugabe has an open door policy or blocks entry to everyone, because nobody wants to live in Zimbabwe. The same applies to Saudi Arabia (a quasi-fascist theocracy) and Bhutan (a nice place to visit but nobody wants to live there).

    It matters when someone suggest that us being more restrictive would be unprecedented.

    Iain I reckon Australia could double its population within ten years and provided they didn’t all cling to the major cities and the coastline, we’d have no major issues. Water is a problem that can be managed with infrastructure developments. Haven’t you heard we’ve got a big desal plant going spare down here, thanks to Steve Brackish and John Bumbly?

    The lessons of history are that for migration to be acceptable to a host population it has to be a a small enough magnitude for the immigrants to be readily assimilated, If it is rushed you risk the host population feeling threatened and resentful of the newcomers. Their may be some economic “advantages” but I expect that the value of the economic benefit will not exceed the inevitable social conflict that a too fast immigration program may cause.

    That’s odd, I never picked you for a Greenie!

    I’ve been a environmentalist all my life Brian.
    Tel

    Oh they would steadfastly refuse to buy our wheat, our rice, our beef, our lamb and our sugar. I really respect anyone willing to starve themselves and their family for the sake of a principle. Or I would do, if I ever met someone like that.

    Precisely right, they may whine and moan a bit but in the end they want our produce and the despotic regimes don’t care about their own people anyway.

  36. GD says:

    If we acquire an international reputation as a racist nation, far fewer people of ANY nationality or ethnicity will want to come here.

    Oh really, and your evidence for that is? Come on Brian you are being hysterical.

    If we acquire an international reputation as a racist nation, far fewer people of ANY nationality or ethnicity will want to come here.

    Wow, and our care factor is what?

    We, as a free country don’t, and shouldn’t, have to pander to third world totalitarian nations in order to garner favour on the international stage. Our record is exemplary compared to theirs, yet leftards such as yourself for some reason think that we have to kowtow to third world failed nations.

    I am not proposing to ban all Islamic immigration, despite what Ray and you maintain. However, I, like many conservatives, would appreciate a review of the current immigration policies, with a view to examining the balance of ethnicities being currently imported into Australia.

    I would hope that skilled European or Asian immigrants would balance out this influx of unskilled Muslim imports. Given the news reports, I don’t think that is the case. If it is, then the Muslims are either behaving badly in their newly adopted country or their numbers are too many.

    In essence, Italians, Christians, Greeks, Europeans et al have managed to integrate over the past fifty years, yet somehow Muslims can’t get with the program. They seek to change it. Sharia is constantly mentioned. And yet they are only 2% of the population. God forbid when they become 5%, as their current birthrate indicates.

    Why aren’t we importing more Buddhists? Why aren’t the left championing Buddhist Asians? Because Asian Buddhists are working for Australia and their new home. Muslim agitators, on the other hand, are working to undermine our country, and uninformed Muslims are following them like the Pied Piper.

    And the Left are championing them. Go figure!

  37. Brian says:

    Oh really, and your evidence for that is? Come on Brian you are being hysterical.

    There’s something richly ironic about you demanding evidence and then calling someone else hysterical.

    We, as a free country don’t, and shouldn’t, have to pander to third world totalitarian nations in order to garner favour on the international stage.

    No, but it is incumbent on us to do the right thing. If we shut the doors on the basis of race and religion, we will be held to account. You can bleat all you like but that is the reality. Do you think the 200,000 Chinese tourists we get each year will want to come here if they think we are a racist nation? Of course not. How many tourists and trade deals do you think South Africa had back in the 80s?

    In essence, Italians, Christians, Greeks, Europeans et al have managed to integrate over the past fifty years, yet somehow Muslims can’t get with the program.

    It took Italians and Greeks the better part of 25 years to start to integrate. Muslims have hardly been here that long in any number. (You’ve already claimed they’ve been here for “three generations”, only to have your claim shot down in flames.)

    Why aren’t we importing more Buddhists? Why aren’t the left championing Buddhist Asians?

    They were, in the 1970s when Malcolm Fraser let in 150,000 Vietnamese refugees. And people like you bitched and moaned back then.

    Muslim agitators, on the other hand, are working to undermine our country

    Well if that’s what you really think then why don’t you leave. I doubt we’ll feel your loss too much as there’ll be other xenophobes to take up the cudgels.

  38. Ray Dixon says:

    That’s what I’ve been telling you for years, GD. You seem to hate the country, or what’s it’s become, and there’s no chance that even your precious Liberals would listen to your extreme views and ban muslim immigration. And the aborigines are here to stay as are their assistance programs (regardless of who’s in Government). So go, mate – the only question is where. New Zealand might be a problem beause they have a large Maori population who actually have rights under their constitution but I reckon it’s still the place for you to express your racist views. I’d love to see the reaction to your views on indigenous welfare over there.

  39. Damian says:

    Iain’s mentioned that he’s disappointed Wilders won’t speak in Brisbane, so I assume that means he won’t get to hear him. But besides the blog master, is anyone here planning on seeing Wilders? Maybe a guest author could write about the event.

  40. Brian says:

    I’m surprised he’s not speaking in Brisbane. I thought Qld would have been his first port of call. Followed by western Sydney. And maybe a private function at Andrew Bolt’s house.

  41. Iain Hall says:

    Damian
    I expect that you are on standby to join the inevitable Muslim protests that the man would dare be critical of Islam.
    Brian
    I find you attitude to critics of Islam rather strange. In one breath you tell us that you think the religion both regressive and nasty but then in the next you attribute all kinds of nasty motives to anyone who voices suspicion about any aspect of the faith or the social practices of its followers. Frankly that sounds rather like having a bob each way and still losing to me.

  42. Brian says:

    No mate, I’m just able to differentiate between ordinary people and the stupid religions they happen to follow. Being a “critic of Islam” is one thing, but using this as a flimsy veil for your own racism or xenophobia is another.

    I’m quite sure that the vast majority of Muslims who come to Australia will, in time, become more moderate, modern and secular. Unless of course we start singling them out for persecution, which while drive them straight into the arms of fundamentalist and lunatic imams.

    As for “losing”, I don’t think so. Nobody is rushing to close the borders like you and “GD” have suggested, so if anyone is “losing” then it is you two.

  43. Iain Hall says:

    Brian

    I’m quite sure that the vast majority of Muslims who come to Australia will, in time, become more moderate, modern and secular. Unless of course we start singling them out for persecution, which while drive them straight into the arms of fundamentalist and lunatic imams.

    The experience overseas does not support your expectations Brian because it has been the second and subsequent generations who seem to be most amenable to the Jihadist seduction. But I dispute your assertion that either GD or I are in any way “persecuting” followers of Islam any more than minions of the left are persecuting Catholics when they vociferously denounce kiddie fiddler priests.

  44. Brian says:

    “The experience overseas”, in my opinion, has been blown out of all proportion by politicians like Wilders and the BNP, right wing rags like the Daily Mail and other panic merchants. There is no Sharia law or legalised polygamy in the UK, as is often claimed. Yes, some parts of the UK, France and the Netherlands have a problem with disaffected young Muslims, a small portion of whom turn to radicalism. But in reality this has less to do with the tenets of Islam than it does issues like education, unemployment, welfare addition and ghettoisation.

    I have certainly seen you condemn moderate Muslims who don’t distance themselves from radicals, which in my view is fair enough. I reserve the same scorn for devout Catholics who refuse to listen to or accept criticism of their church for the way it has covered up sexual abuse and protected serial offenders in the priesthood.

  45. Richard Ryan says:

    When will David Irving the holocaust denier be invited to Australia—–oh oh, stop that. Shalom, Richard Ryan.

  46. Richard Ryan says:

    HA-HA dinner at Bolts house—–what a double—-double dutch.snigger-snigger

  47. Damian says:

    Thanks for the irrelevant response, Blog Master.

  48. Richard Ryan says:

    Ah yes! Andrew Bolt, the man with the relentless smirk.

  49. GD says:

    is anyone here planning on seeing Wilders? Maybe a guest author could write about the event.

    Damian, I’m hoping to. I will unfortunately miss the one in Sydney as I’ll be in Victoria, but am hoping to make the short trip to Melbourne to hear his wisdom. Otherwise, I’m sure there will be funded lefties in the audience positioned to report back to the party faithful. Either way, Damo, you’ll get the gist.

  50. GD says:

    some parts of the UK, France and the Netherlands have a problem with disaffected young Muslims, a small portion of whom turn to radicalism. But in reality this has less to do with the tenets of Islam than it does issues like education, unemployment, welfare addition and ghettoisation.

    Brian this goes against all you’ve said about Muslims in Australia. In Australia, Muslims have the same chances of education as any other Australian. Unemployment? I thought you denied that there was a high level of unemployment in Muslim suburbs. Ghettoisation? You only have to look at the enclaves in Auburn, Lakemba and Bankstown to see that ‘ghettoisation’, if that is a word, is self-inflicted.

    Australia is following in the footsteps of Britain and Europe, make no mistake about that. While you and I won’t be around to see most of it, we will see the rot begin, unless governments, worldwide, take umbrage at the outrageous attempts by the Islamic culture to usurp Western civilisation.

    The average muslim in Australia isn’t part of this, yet they probably attend a mosque, where these views are regularly presented. It’s a slippery slope. They are inured regularly to such views.

    Remember, we aren’t importing evil Catholic paedophiles or bikie gangs. They are our problem. They are home-grown. However, we are importing Sheik Hilalay* and his mob of insurgents, along with a deplorable list of wannabe terrorists. Fortunately some have been detained and locked up. Others, we don’t know. Where there is smoke there is fire.

    And all the time, moderate muslims attend the mosque and are inculcated with this anti-western propaganda, all the while enjoying the benefits of life in Australia.

    Something is wrong here.

    *thank Paul Keating for insisting that Sheik Hilaly be allowed to enter the country. He was considered a risk then, but Keating thought otherwise.

  51. Richard Ryan says:

    Australia Day—–who cares, the original inhabitants don’t, neither do I. Shalom.

  52. Richard Ryan says:

    GD, Wilders? I hope his plane crashes, before it lands here

  53. Iain Hall says:

    Damian

    Thanks for the irrelevant response, Blog Master.

    It would have been entirely unacceptable for me to speak on behalf of any of the other authors here regarding their social calendar so I didn’t do so. However I notice that you don’t deny that you would like to attend any anti- Wilders protest.

  54. Tel says:

    The average muslim in Australia isn’t part of this, yet they probably attend a mosque, where these views are regularly presented. It’s a slippery slope. They are inured regularly to such views.

    Yeah, I think that identifies the problem, and it isn’t unique to Islam. Once you have a religion or any group of people with some sort of identity politics happening, sure as eggs the next step is that someone from that group tries to outdo the others by being more extreme, more holy than thou and proves their identity is the purest and most dedicated.

    So you have the Greens, and you know there’s a legitimate claim in protecting the environment as common property, but then you get guys who want to start micro-managing everything we do, who decide that they and only they are the true spokesmen of the environment. Then they get all righteous and start calling for dumber and dumber things and get nasty when someone tries to point out common sense.

    You have the animal rights people, and again, there’s a legitimate claim in minimising cruelty, but they have to prove themselves by going one better, more super, ultra, vegan than thou, lives on nothing but the smell of a celery stick (and looks like a stick). Once they get that tiny political foothold they whip it for all it’s worth.

    So I think Islam is more susceptible to this than most religions. Sheik Hilaly doesn’t represent your typical suburban Muslim family, but it seems there’s this trend of people being so amazingly easy to offend, with outrageous punishments for blasphemy that the sane people are cautious about speaking out against the nut cases. As a consequence, being an extremist gets you places within Islam where it won’t get you places in other religions.

    We kind of beat that with our Western tradition, that there’s always been a tradition of the little guy standing up against official stupidity. The whole “Emperor has no clothes” way of seeing the world. This is very old and strong in the Christian world, consider the Anabaptists, the various protest movements, Luther speaking out against money-making indulgences. There’s heaps of examples. This principle of speaking truth to power is one of the most valuable thing we have from our Western European tradition. You can look at our visible technology and science, but that’s all an after effect.

    By the way, the problems with paedophiles in the Catholic church aren’t the same kind of thing. That’s just common or garden corruption, supported by stealth and cunning. You will find that everywhere as well, but no Catholic jumps up and shouts, “Ra! Ra! Paedophilia, I’m a hero!”

  55. Damian says:

    Entirely unacceptable to comment on anyone else’s social calendar – unless it’s my supposed protest attendance.

  56. Iain Hall says:

    Funnily enough you are correct Damian.

    Great comment Tel 😀

  57. Jennifer Pierno says:

    We live in a democracy. Mr Wilders is entitled to speak here. That’s what democracy is.

  58. Brian says:

    Brian this goes against all you’ve said about Muslims in Australia. In Australia, Muslims have the same chances of education as any other Australian. Unemployment? I thought you denied that there was a high level of unemployment in Muslim suburbs.

    It doesn’t go against anything I’ve said. I’ve never denied that there might be a problem with Muslims in certain suburbs or areas. I only dispute that these problems are across the board nationwide, and that they are entirely caused by Islam.

    From what I can tell, most of the anti-social behaviour exhibited by Muslims in western Sydney is not much different to the anti-social behaviour exhibited by ghettoised immigrants in many times and places. They can’t speak the language, they struggle with education, they can’t find jobs, they can’t connect with the broader community, ergo they misbehave. And they resort to religion, which as it often does, preys on the alienated and the disaffected by offering them community and false explanations about their problems.

    Also, I never asserted or denied anything about unemployment. I simply asked you to produce evidence to support your own claims. And you didn’t.

    By the way, the problems with paedophiles in the Catholic church aren’t the same kind of thing. That’s just common or garden corruption, supported by stealth and cunning.

    Yes, by an organisation, supposedly one of the most benevolent organisations, trying to conceal its own deficiencies. If a school or a hospital or a government department engaged in cover-ups of that nature, there would be many criminal charges laid.

  59. Tel says:

    If a school or a hospital or a government department engaged in cover-ups of that nature, there would be many criminal charges laid.

    Yeah, like the way the US Department of Justice relentlessly pursued the big banks for covering up their worthless assets (and the assets they sold to dumb punters), not to mention vast arrays of quasi-legal side accounts and derivative trades? Like the way the US government ruthlessly got to the bottom of that dreadful business of walking assault rifles into Mexico for the benefit of drug dealers? Like the way Fair Work Australia cracked down hard on union slush funds, credit cards, and account keeping. Don’t try and tell those guys, “I lost the documents” because that’ll just make ’em angry. Whoa, don’t even think about saying, “I don’t recall”, unless you want a quick taste of the water board. Oh yeah, those guys are tough.

    Lenny Breuer lost his job because one day he accidentally parked his car in the boss’s space, and that’s all it take, one little slip — little known, but true!

    The criminals must be wetting themselves (with laughter).

  60. Tel says:

    Here’s a brave young man went to war and died for his country. I mean we need people like that, war is hell but sometimes there’s no other way. So what did he die of? Bullets? IED?

    http://militarytimes.com/valor/army-staff-sgt-ryan-d-maseth/3291713

    Hmmm, seems he died of electrocution in the shower at his own base. Talk about bad luck. Oh wait, 12 people died the same way, from bad wiring, because their own team couldn’t do a simple job of hooking up some cables. I mean surely heads would roll over that one. To quote a great man, “there would be many criminal charges laid”… yeah well actually the contractor got let off. No one’s fault really… there you go.

    The inspector general’s report said while electrical systems in Iraq were known to “pose a hazard to personnel,” there is no evidence Houston-based KBR Inc. was aware of any life-threatening hazards at the Army barracks where Sgt. Ryan Maseth died.

    There you have it, “not aware of any life-threatening hazards”, brilliant! Amazing what you can not see, when you don’t look. Amazing how it works.

  61. GD says:

    From what I can tell, most of the anti-social behaviour exhibited by Muslims in western Sydney is not much different to the anti-social behaviour exhibited by ghettoised immigrants in many times and places. They can’t speak the language, they struggle with education, they can’t find jobs, they can’t connect with the broader community, ergo they misbehave. And they resort to religion, which as it often does, preys on the alienated and the disaffected by offering them community and false explanations about their problems.

    Whoa, hang on Brian, that's a lot of codswallop in one go. Let's take it a bite at a time.

    They can’t speak the language, they struggle with education.

    Omar the Crate seems to have learnt the language just fine and dandy. He's got a Facebook page and is skiting about rorting the disability pension.

    they can’t find jobs

    I guess if you turn up for a job interview wearing this you're unlikely to be selected. Duh!

    they can’t connect with the broader community, ergo they misbehave

    Oh pray tell, you're asking me to shed crocodile tears here. These young misfits are mobile phone and internet savvy, they are connecting quicker to the broader community than you and I. They organised a raid on Cronulla quicker than the police could stop it.

    They certainly connected with each other:

    All Arabs unite as one, we will never back down, the Aussies will feel the full force of the Arabs. Destroy everything, gather at Cronulla December 18 at midday - spread the word. Together exterminate the enemy at Cronulla. Send this to every lion of Lebanon. - Text message circulating amongst Lebanese gang members

    And then this

    ghettoised immigrants

    Nobody has shepherded them into Lakemba, Bankstown Auburn and surrounds. Like anyone else they prefer to be with their own kind. A fact that seems to escape the leftie multiculturists. Muslims have created their own ghetto. Well maybe it's not a ghetto, but it's certainly a separate society to the rest of Australia.

    It is not a Chinatown.

    The way this is going, it will be a long time before you will be taking your wife or partner to 'Arabtown' for a meal and a drink.

    Saluté

  62. Richard Ryan says:

    YEAH-YEAH Happy Invasion Day—-26 January.

  63. Iain Hall says:

    Richard
    The simple fact of history is that a people who can not exclude other claimants to territory have no real ownership of it anyway.

  64. Ray Dixon says:

    And Aussies like to live with ‘their own kind’ too, don’t they GD. Why do you think we have certain types and classes of suburbs that only attract certain groups? Why do think we have places like Toorak where the wealthy congregate? Not many new migrants there. Doncaster, which is an upper-middle class suburb, has a high concentration of Chinese. I could name plenty of other parts of Melbourne that have ‘similar types’ and I guess the same could be said for Sydney. And I also guess the reason the muslim new arrivals are in suburbs like Lakemba is because they’re cheap, lower class areas. So new migrants of similar background are attracted to live close to each other in downmarket suburbs … what the f*ck is new?

    As for the rest of your drivel, it’s just your usual cherry-picking bigoted nonsense. You quote a text sent around among Lebanese youth as though it f*cking means anything. It doesn’t, that’s just gang warfare among the young – it goes on GD.

  65. Brian says:

    Omar the Crate seems to have learnt the language just fine and dandy. He’s got a Facebook page and is skiting about rorting the disability pension.

    “GD”, your article about Omar rorting welfare proves that… there’s someone out there rorting welfare. There’s plenty of whites, blacks and yellows who do too. Do you have any evidence that Muslims are committing welfare fraud at higher rates than other Australians? No, of course you don’t.

    I guess if you turn up for a job interview wearing this you’re unlikely to be selected.

    I thought it was common knowledge that the burka was worn by only a small percentage of Muslim women. And if they are wearing burkas then I very much doubt they’re going to be anything but housewives in the first place, so your point is meaningless.

    These young misfits are mobile phone and internet savvy, they are connecting quicker to the broader community than you and I.

    They are mobile phone and internet savvy because their generation is. That doesn’t mean they’re connecting to anyone beyond their own family or community.

    Nobody has shepherded them into Lakemba, Bankstown Auburn and surrounds. Like anyone else they prefer to be with their own kind.

    You should change your initials from “GD” to “NSS” (“No shit, Sherlock”). Of course they prefer to live with their own kind. That’s what immigrants to Australia have been doing since 1788.

  66. […] Geert Wilders' speaking tour (iainhall.wordpress.com) […]

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