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Who’s telling the truth – Tony or Tony?

“I would do anything for this job. The only thing I wouldn’t do is sell my arse — but I’d have to give serious thought to it.”

There are four reasons why I believe independent MP Tony Windsor was telling the truth about what Tony Abbott hinted at offering in return for Windsor supporting him as PM last year:

1.  Abbott’s denial doesn’t sound very convincing: 

“People who know me know that I don’t speak like that.

Sure, after the election I wanted to secure government because I wanted to save our country from what was already a bad government and I think that what we’ve seen since then vindicated my judgment.

I engaged in a negotiation . . . but I think that some of the people that I was negotiating with had already made up their minds.”

Hmm, that’s not actually a denial, Tony. “People who know you” weren’t there.

2. He’s a cyclist:

Tony Abbott offers the whole 'package'.

3. The people he hangs out with:

"I'm next."

4. He’s sold his arse before:

Pyne - "Best fifty bucks I ever spent" .. Abbott - "He's so short I don't even have to bend over."

.


49 Comments

  1. Richard Ryan says:

    Well–Well! Abbott was Howard’s “altar boy”

  2. Richard Ryan says:

    ON second thoughts: I thought Abbott sold his arse to Alan Jones—–to horrible to imagine!

  3. Ray Dixon says:

    If only he’d made that offer to the Greens.

  4. Iain Hall says:

    I don’t buy Tony Windsor’s story at all Ray, it strikes me as nothing more than an example of the unreliability of memory and the way that Windsor’s is likely to be confusing his impressions of Tony Abbott’s determination to convince Windsor to back the coalition with what Abbott may have said in passing or in jest.

  5. Ray Dixon says:

    That’s a diversion, Iain, and has nothing to do with this (rather funny) story. And your link doesn’t work – maybe The Australian had to pull that story?

    Anyway, I tend to believe Windsor’s account of what Tony Abbott said. Come on, read Abbott’s so-called denial – you know as well as I do that he’s avoided saying straight out, “No, I didn’t say that.”

  6. Iain Hall says:

    Ray
    Do remember verbatim every conversation that you had a year ago?
    Memory is notoriously unreliable and even when both parties have good reason to remember the events and an equal dedication to giving a true and honest recollection they will not tell the same verbatim description of what was said at a meeting a year in the past. memory just does not work like a VCR or any sort of recording device and when we try to recall something from our past we dredge up fragments of the event and then in the retelling we fill in the gaps, this comes not from a desire to deceive but the way that memory works and there is no need to suggest that either side of the story is consciously being deceptive here its just that they recall the events differently.

  7. Ray Dixon says:

    Iain, you protesteth too much. So has Abbott. If he doesn’t recall it then why wouldn’t he just say something like this?:

    “Look, I don’t recall exactly every discussion I had with Tony Windsor but if I did say something in that vein it was obviously said in a light hearted manner. I’m not a rent boy for anyone.”

    That’d be more honest, instead of covering up with the flimsy response he gave. Then it would no longer be news, I wouldn’t have posted about it and you wouldn’t be defending him against your better judgement. Gee, you conservatives are very precious about your Tony – maybe he does hire it out?

  8. Iain Hall says:

    No Ray I think that its a non story to be honest and i tend to think that Tony may well have made a joke of that sort and instantly forgotten it given that he was undoubtedly more focused on the actual negotiations rather than the off handed banter and phatic conversation. I am not “defending him against my better judgement”I am defending him because this is a a triviality of no consequence.

  9. Ray Dixon says:

    The point of Windsor recalling the story was to demonstrate how he felt Abbott was just “too desperate” to be PM.

  10. Ray Dixon says:

    Btw, Iain, would it be “a triviality of no consequence” if Gillard had said it?

  11. Iain Hall says:

    Ray I think that you use the word ‘recanting” in the wrong context here it means to withdraw or repudiate something that you have previously said.

  12. Ray Dixon says:

    Yes!! Fixed now, Iain. What about the question: “would it be ‘a triviality of no consequence’ if Gillard had said it?”

  13. Iain Hall says:

    Yes actaully especially at this remove in time. In any case she obviously did sell her arse for the job!
    but did you see Wilkie on the Insiders yesterday? When he berated Gillard for so easily giving in to the greens on the carbon tax? as i recall it his words were “Like the greens were nver going to back Tony Abbott” hmm do remember who else has been saying precisely that?

  14. Luzu says:

    What is it with ‘straight’ men making jokes about guys sodomising each other? Obviously I move in very different circles.

    “I actually gained a much higher personal regard for him during that period of a fortnight and I thought he was serious about some of the things that he was saying to us privately and publicly.” Tony Windsor

    So which is it, Tony? Either TA can’t be trusted and yet you like him more for trying to be PM? Or you’re one of these people who likes to make jokes about men sodomising one another?

    Either way, we need a total cleanout of all our politicains.

  15. Ray Dixon says:

    That’s my point, Iain – if Windsor had said Gillard offered to literally “sell her arse”, you’d have jumped in and been all over it. Yet because it’s Abbott, it’s “trivial and of no consequence”.

    That said, I agree that Gillard sold out too easily to the Greens. And to Wilkie. How hypocritical is it of Wilkie to criticise her for doing that when he made it abundantly clear that NATIONAL pokies reform was absolutely a condition of his support .. and still is? And this from a bloke who polled how many votes? About 20,000 (or 20%) in an electorate way down in Hobart. Givemeabreak.

    Luzu, I don’t think Windsor was joking about sodomy. He was just saying what happened. If your comment is also directed at me (I’m not sure if it is), then I’m just commenting on the news, not making it … or jokes. Although you gotta admit, it’s funny.

  16. brad.k says:

    this article is offensive!

  17. Iain Hall says:

    Well even if what is attributed to Abbott was a verbatim and verifiable quote what does it tell us ? That Tony Abbott was making a rather self effacing joke at his own expense that really had no bearing on the outcome of the negotiation.

  18. Ray Dixon says:

    To whom, brad? And why? Explain yourself.

  19. Iain Hall says:

    Welcome to the Sandpit Brad,
    I don’t agree with Ray’s line here either but one of the things I value in our democracy is free speech and having varied points of view freely presented. So this blog unlike so many others is not just a place where everyone walks in political lockstep for one side or the other.

  20. Ray Dixon says:

    Not agreeing with me is fine, Iain. But saying it’s “offensive” (as brad did) without saying to whom and why is just trolling.

  21. Iain Hall says:

    Ray
    what do you expect from a plumber?

  22. Ray Dixon says:

    what do you expect from a plumber?

    Good drainage and taps that don’t leak. Know any?

  23. Iain Hall says:

    Brad is a Plumber Ray 😉

  24. Ray Dixon says:

    Yeah, I got that, but is he any good at sewerage?

  25. GD says:

    I don’t know, but this post’s a good example of it 😀

  26. Iain Hall says:

    Who knows, but then he does seem good at chucking it about!

  27. Ray Dixon says:

    GD, you’d be singing a different tune if it had been Gillard, not Abbott.

    Iain, I’m yet to meet a plumber who knows how to do anything but rough work. Even the ones who can lay and connect pipes correctly don’t seem to care how much damage they do to other parts of the building in doing it. They’re a nightmare.

  28. GD says:

    Of course! and I agree with the 2nd part of your reply too 😦

  29. Ray Dixon says:

    Btw you guys have both misunderstood something. I was talking about sewerage, not sewage. You know, the pipes and stuff, not the shit that goes in it.

  30. Ray Dixon says:

    I can’t help it. I was born that way.

  31. damage says:

    And Windsor simply bought the biggest arse not the cheapest. And Gillard stabbed the arse in the back.

  32. Craigy says:

    “In any event Ray this may prove to be far more important:”

    If this is the one the Australian had to remove and then post an apology, then sucked in Iain……Boy conservative politics is desperate these days. Just jump on any lie, don’t think or check, it’s all okay as long as the party can benefit. It’s sick so I’m sticking my head out the window and yelling ‘I’m not taking it any more’!!!

  33. Ray Dixon says:

    That explains why the link didn’t work, Craigy. It looked pretty defamatory to me.

  34. Craigy says:

    Tsk tsk, Iain. You should appologise to the PM for being so easly sucked in by poor News Ltd typists, we have warned you before.

    Here it is Ray:

    http://blogs.crikey.com.au/purepoison/2011/08/29/is-anyone-at-news-monitoring-andrew-bolts-blog/

  35. Iain Hall says:

    Craigy
    Now I read the original Glen Milne piece that the quote is from and I really don’t see how it was at all defamatory, Likewise I think that Andrew Bolt has virtually gone on strike over his treatment by the editorial staff shows that he does have some principles. and if you think he will in any way be diminished by thsi incident then you are utterly wrong.

  36. Ray Dixon says:

    Iain, as the Australian has removed Milne’s article, acknowledged that it was untrue and apologised, I don’t think it’s a good look that your reproduction of the same words remains here … especially on my post. I won’t be so audacious as to edit your comment on your blog (even though I could) but … your call. I just want to remove myself from any association with it as the author of this post.

  37. Craigy says:

    Your right Iain, he won’t be diminished, we all know he is a liar and will say anything to please his boss and sell a paper. and as for Milne, well…. cheers to him!

  38. Iain Hall says:

    Craigy
    Love him or hate him people specifically buy the paper or click onto his blog to see what he has to say , frankly he is such a “star” in the news Ltd universe that he has a far greater bargaining power than any other employee so I think you do him a grave disservice by suggesting that when Rupert says “Jump !” that he is just going to ask “how high”.
    Now from the tone of his update to today’s cryptic post:

    Afrer discussions, I now feel free to speak my mind. So I shall. In tomorrow’s column. I apologise for the mysteriousness, but I did not want to act in anger or before matters had been resolved. I had to be fair to my employer and to my readers, and I apologise if you think I’ve had the balance wrong over the past 24 hours.

    Thank you to everyone who has rung, emailed or commented on this post, here and on radio.

    That is not the words of a beaten man 😉

  39. Ray Dixon says:

    Come on, Iain, this is what The Australian has published:

    THE AUSTRALIAN published today an opinion piece by Glenn Milne which includes assertions about the conduct of the Prime Minister.

    The Australian acknowledges these assertions are untrue. The Australian also acknowledges no attempt was made by anyone employed by, or associated with, The Australian to contact the Prime Minister in relation to this matter.

    The Australian unreservedly apologises to the Prime Minister and to its readers for the publication of these claims.

    I think Bolt is going to follow suit by saying something like “I was taking advice from a trusted News Ltd journo who proved to be unreliable (and a f*cking prick!)”.

    What about you?

  40. Iain Hall says:

    What precisely do you think that I have to apologise for Ray?
    All that I have done is cited a quote from the newspaper and said that I thought is was interesting, I think the whole issue is even more interesting now to be honest 😉

  41. Ray Dixon says:

    Your blog, your choice, Iain, but you’ve done the same thing as The Australian – i.e. you’ve published Milne’s article that they have since acknowledged was untrue (read defamatory) and removed. You know very well that repeating defamation makes you liable for it.

  42. Iain Hall says:

    Ray
    I have nothing to apologise for
    But I have removed the comment form public view as a precaution.end of topic as far as I’m concerned.

  43. Ray Dixon says:

    I wasn’t saying you should apologise, Iain, because you were not the source of the article. But removing it is prudent.

  44. Richard Ryan says:

    Andrew Bolt is weighing up his principles, did not know he had principles, he does work for Murdoch, and they have no principles what so ever. The man should be sacked,

  45. Richard Ryan says:

    AH yes! As the old saying goes,a lawyer with a briefcase, is more dangerous then a 1000 men with guns—–amazing how all the wordsmiths with principles go to water——puddles of water everywhere at the Australian today. Bolt is finished, his non stop bile on Gillard on his blog-site, is also finished, as it should be, as is his stint on CH.10. Iain! I told you Bolt would more or less not last the distance He would have done well at News of the World. He goes on about free speech, will someone tell the media clown——–free speech with truth——-Shalom Richard Ryan.

  46. Iain Hall says:

    Oh Richard, I think that you are going to be rather disappointed and I think that you will find Bolt et al back to kicking Julia’s arse tomorrow

  47. Ray Dixon says:

    Yes, as much as it disappoints me to say so, I think Iain is right, Richard, and – like a bad smell – Bolt will just not go away.

  48. […] AH yes! As the old saying goes,a lawyer with a briefcase, is more dangerous then a 1000 men with guns—–amazing how all the wordsmiths with principles go to water——puddles of water everywhere at the Australian today. Bolt is finished, his non stop bile on Gillard on his blog-site, is also finished, as it should be, as is his stint on CH.10. Iain! I told you Bolt would more or less not last the distance He would have done well at News of the World. He goes on about free speech, will someone tell the media clown——–free speech with truth——-Shalom Richard Ryan. […]

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