Where are the protesters when it comes to real atrocities committed in the name of God?
Where are the leftard protesters when a theocracy is about to kill 9 people for adultery? Reports in recent days showed them getting all hot under the collar about the Catholic Church’s objection to abortion and contraception yet when the lives nine individuals are about to be brutally snuffed out in a most barbaric manner I bet that we will hear not one word to denounce a faith far more brutal and far more willing to impose its dogma on the people of Iran than any Catholic ruler in the modern era.
Lawyer and women’s rights activist, Shadi Sadr, said the nine were convicted of adultery in separate cases in different Iranian cities.
“Their verdicts are approved, and they may be executed at any time,” she told reporters.
Sadr, who has been leading a campaign in Iran against stoning deaths since 2006, said trial protocol was not applied properly in the cases. Six of the nine were convicted based solely on judges’ decisions with no witnesses or no lawyers present during their confessions, she said.
Most of the nine come from areas of Iran that have low rates of literacy, and some did not understand the cases against them, she said.
One of Sadr’s colleagues, Mohammad Mostafai, said his client, Malak Qorbani, had pleaded guilty to adultery even though she did not know the meaning of the charge.
The nine are between 27 and 50 years old, among them a male music teacher who was convicted of adultery for having an affair with one of his students, the activists said.
“We are trying to stop the implementation of their verdicts. And secondly, we want to amend the country’s penal law, in which death by stoning is prescribed,” Sadr said.
Compared to the situation in Iran, not advocating the use of condoms , claiming that Homosexuality is a sin, suggesting that abortion may actually be killing a child is all pretty small beer. But I bet that there will be no protests outside the Iranian embassy anytime soon from the evangelical atheists who have been trying so hard to pester the participants of World Youth day and succeeded only in making themselves look very stupid indeed.
Cheers Comrades
Filed under: Ethical questions, Gay issues, Gender Issues, Global Warming, God bothering, Green Hypocrites, Iran, Justice, Law, Leftism, Men and Women, Mysogeny, Political Correctness, international politics
This is a long bow if ever I saw one. It’s like…you’re using an atrocity to take cheap shots at atheists? Why? Atheism has nothing to do with the article! You’re basically just saying, ‘Oh, look, atheists are scum, I bet they’d rather be pissing off Catholics than fighting THESE guys’ when you actually have NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER THAT THIS ISN’T ALREADY HAPPENING. You’ve just assumed it’s not, because you’re looking to complain about atheists protesting World Youth Day – which is utterly unrelated to your opening article!
Un-be-freakin’-lievable.
“Where are the leftard protesters…”
I believe they’re called Amnesty International, Iain.
You CAN disagree with more than one thing at a time, you know.
I don’t see what our political leanings over here and/or protests about other issues, has got to do with Iran’s barbaric justice system. I’m not aware of anyone who supports it, are you?
I don’t see what our political leanings over here and/or protests about other issues, has got to do with Iran’s barbaric justice system. I’m not aware of anyone who supports it, are you?
But Ray, dont you know, in Iain’s world not actively protesting about something means you implicitly support it! Hence Iain himself must a pro-whaling supporter becuase he doesn’t campaign against it.
Likwise the left implicitly supports the Iranian regimes brutality becuase their not ‘actively’ campaigning against it. Except maybe Amnesty – but I’m sure they don’t count somehow in Iains thinking.
Actually Iain – perhaps you can enlighten us and make your case at the same time. How many *right* wing organisations will there be protesting outside the Iranian embassy versus left wing groups?
Bet you don’t give us a straight answer on that one!
Foz
Sure it is a long bow but as an atheist myself I feel entitled to be critical of those who share my own disbelief in any deity but who exhibit an intolerance of those who do believe in a God. As for evidence that this is the case just look to the empty streets outside the Iranian Embassy.
Keri
Nah i don’t buy that line
Ray
My point is that the silence from the left is deafening when it comes to injustice in Islamic countries , unless they can blame the USA.
PKD
lets look at your claims in turn
First sentence is spot on and the way that the left is so willing to criticise any attempt by Israel or the USA to counter Iran’s nuclear ambitions is another black mark against them as well.But I actually have a great deal of respect for Amnesty FYI.
Probably none, however there will undoubtedly be plenty of conservative bloggers who will be denouncing the excesses of the Iranian Theocracy how many lefty bloggers will do likewise?
How many *right* wing organisations will there be protesting outside the Iranian embassy versus left wing groups
How many right-wing groups have ever protested outside the Iranian embasasy in relation to human rights violations? For that matter, how many right-wing groups have ever protested over human rights violations period?
I’d be amazed if the answer was anything other than zero. Which is, broadly speaking, completely in line with my appreciation of the Right’s concern over maintaining human rights standards.
I’d be amazed if the answer was anything other than zero.
Indeed – did you notice how Iain skipped answering the tricky right-wing question. Guess he doesn’t want a admit a central plank of his rant is undermined by the lack of right wing protesters breaking down the Iranian Embassies doors while fighting the good fight!
I bet we don’t see any of Crusader Rabid’s or AWH’s commentators outside the embassy with placards for instance!
Oops – sorry Iain you did give an answer – my apologies! I’m was *sure* it wasn’t in your post first time it appeared though. Guess I’ll get my eyes tested though anyway!
Probably none, however there will undoubtedly be plenty of conservative bloggers who will be denouncing the excesses of the Iranian Theocracy how many lefty bloggers will do likewise?
Just checked the dismal depths of AFWH and Crusader Rabid – guess what? You’re the only one who’s mentioned it! Must be the closet lefty in you Iain, these far-right sites seem to have missed it!
PKD
as your comment was not there when I started that one.
there is a reason you missed it, it was not there originally because rather than posting a new comment I added to my previous one as an edit
Give them time and they may well write about it, but I suspect that you will wait far longer for LP or any other leftie site to do likewise.
Ian, you puzzle me. Going off what I’ve read of your blog, you come across as vehemently right-wing, and yet you end every post with ‘cheers, comrades’. For the sake of curiosity, what gives?
Hi Foz
the truth of the matter is that I sign off my posts with “Cheers Comrades” because I think that the left have no monopoly on altruistic fraternity. Also I know that my doing so does get up the noses of some irony challenged lefties and that makes me chuckle every time
“Nah i don’t buy that line”
Erm, which one, Iain?
however there will undoubtedly be plenty of conservative bloggers who will be denouncing the excesses of the Iranian Theocracy
Which, as we all know perfectly well, belies nothing more than a desperate need to find plausible reasons for maintaining an aggressive militaristic posture towards Iran. The level of concern that the right wing holds for the human rights of ordinary middle eastern citizens is perfectly highlighted by their refusal to bother counting the piles of dead bodies in Iraq.
The faux outrage about human rights abuses in countries that these chickenhawks see as the best target for another glorious war fools nobody. It is quite clear what their main agenda is when they throw out the baited hook of Iranian human rights abuses – but the rest of the world isn’t biting Iain.
And nobody on this blog is either, apparently.
Keri I don’t buy your contention that Amnesty’s efforts on Iran are a leftist artefact.
Mondo you provide a perfect example of why the left is so willing to ignore the excesses of the Mullahs, and how they only speak up on human rights in the middle east when they can demonise the United States. Thank you for that
I think you have your conclusion arse-about backwards Iain.
What I actually said was that many on the Left are reluctant to speak up on human rights abuses in the middle east where they perceive that their comments will be used as justification for an aggressive military intervention that has nothing at all to do with addressing those abuses. This reluctance is totally unrelated to ‘demonising’ anything or anyone – it relates solely to the misuse of such comments/actions by those on the Right in furtherance of their desired aggressive militarism.
In other words, it is the Right’s desperate desire to launch another war of aggression that is the main impediment to sustained Left-wing criticism of the Iranian regime.
Mondo
that is the weakest most pathetic excuse for leftist silence on abuses under the Mullahs. You and your pals on the left are always keen to claim to be people of principle and conscience so it should not matter one iota how the right will see their actions.
You and your pals on the left are always keen to claim to be people of principle and conscience so it should not matter one iota how the right will see their actions.
Hmmmn . . . a handful of dead vs several hundred thousand dead – not a particularly difficult ‘principle’ to get one’s head around. Unless, of course, you consider the mass slaughter of innocent civilians to be a “weak and pathetic excuse”.
It has nothing to do with giving the Right ‘justification’ for actions already undertaken Iain (like they care anyway) and everything to do with actually preventing them from attacking Iran. There’s a powerful enough “bomb Iran” lobby as it is – you can imagine the impact that widespread left-wing criticism of Iran’s human rights violations would have if launched in parallel to this lobby and their current efforts.
Human rights abuses are a disgrace, and must be condemned – but not where that condemnation will be used as cover for an aggressive war that will lead to the death of thousands.
More Iain Hall gold… it’s brilliant!
The Left are a bunch of Islamists because they don’t explicitly condemn or criticise Iran or picket the Iranian embassy? Well based on that, Iain Hall supports female circumcision because he has never written a post explicitly condemning it, nor has he picketed the embassies of nations where it is legal. Your support for involuntary female cliterodectomies is SHAMEFUL, Iain.
Also, it’s funny how Iain calls himself an “atheist” here when a few days back he penned an appalling missive that effectively told the victims of sexual abuse within the Catholic church that they should get over it, and that many of them were just after a quick buck. Sounds more like the rantings of a repressed Catholic than an atheist, but there you go.
Okay, Iain. How about the second line:
“You CAN disagree with more than one thing at a time, you know”
If the principle is consistent, do you need to detail every instance of how you disagree with Human Rights infringement? And considering you’re willing to give AWH and Crusader Rabbit time to follow up on the story, why are you unwilling to give Left-Wing bloggers the same priviledge?
Or is it just because that doesn’t fit in with your tarring and feathering of “The Left”
Mondo you have just made the same argument in different words and it is still cowardly poppy cock.
Mark I make my attitude to FGM clear in this post by supporting it’s condemnation BY Janet Albrechtson and I am sure that I have condemned it at other times as well.
Keri Ill give lefties as much time as I give AWH or CR
Mondo you have just made the same argument in different words
Well, it seemed necessary since you completely misinterpreted it the first time around. I attempted to re-state it using simpler and clearer language – what else would you have had me do?
and it is still cowardly poppy cock.
This is just retarded Iain. By choosing not to demonstrate against Iran how am I being any more of a coward than you, who also chooses not to demonstrate?
At least in my case I have a reason for not protesting i.e. not wanting to provide cover for a war that I see as utterly without merit. You on the other hand, despite apparently abhoring Iran’s actions, have no excuse whatsoever. My guess is that human rights abuses mean very little to you in general, apart from when they arise in a context in which you see an opportunity to use them to attack the Left. Not an enormous leap of logic really, since you have only raised them in the current instance as an attempt to attack the Left.
It’s quite a mercenary and immoral way to view human suffering Iain – as little more than a tool to be used in political argument. I think you should take a long hard look in the mirror.
Mondo
your contention is that the left ignore the mad Mullahs because the right may cite such criticism to justify war with Iran, a war that does not in fact exist or that is even likely the fact that you can’t even bring your self to even denounce the excesses of any follower of Mohammed is very telling for you and most of the far left.
Come on admit it you are being very silly here.
Mark I make my attitude to FGM clear in this post by sporting it’s condemnation BY Janet Albrechtson and I am sure that I have condemned it at other times as well.
You didn’t write about it at all, you just lifted quotes from Albrechtsen’s article and tacked on a line or two underneath (in your own inimitable style). Where is your explicit condemnation of female circumcision? What embassies have you protested at about this issue? (I want to see if you’re as slack on the issue as your mythical ‘lefties’ are about Iran…)
Also, to be fair to Iain, his chums at AWH have written many times about Iran: they want to nuke the shit out of it.
I’ll give Iain some credit here – not only is he prepared to come up with a bare-faced double standard about the left implicitly supporting Iran by not protesting at their Embassy (how is the right-wing blogosphere’s campaign coming on BTW Iain?),
BUT, he’s prepared to defend it with the silliest of arguments in the face of the strongest logic. I mean who needs a logical argument when you can just warble on about how the right wing will be doing it’s bit online with fierce worded posts and angry comments???
The fact that its not is irrelevant!
PKD you surely can’t be saying that you endorse Mondo’s argument that the left is silent on human rights abuses in Iran because of the way that the right may perceive that criticism?” But if you do please explain why.
Mark
I also denounce FGM in this post
While I have not written an entire post on the subject search through my 1208 posts and you will find that I consistently denounce FGM where it is mentioned.
your contention is that the left ignore the mad Mullahs because the right may cite such criticism to justify war with Iran
Hmm – I don’t think I speak for the entire Left-wing of politics. I speak for myself Iain. Nonetheless I’d be surprised if there were not at least some lefties who shared my reluctance in this regard.
a war that does not in fact exist or that is even likely
That’s the point Iain – it doesn’t exist. It’s hard to prevent a war that’s already started.
As for its likelihood – try paying closer attention to the US media. A recent Seymore Hersh article in the New Yorker is particularly worth reading.
the fact that you can’t even bring your self to even denounce the excesses of any follower of Mohammed is very telling for you and most of the far left
I regularly denounce both Islam and the behaviour of those who follow it – you don’t know what you’re talking about Iain. The fact that I choose not to do so on your forum is entirely due to my firm belief that you have absolutely no human rights agenda, apart from trying to manufacture ridiculous “gotchas” in relation to imagined double standards.
Lastly – to suggest that my comments, as a single anonymous poster, in relation to this specific issue are ‘telling’ in relation to the entire left-wing is simply ridiculous. A desperate projection.
Your cowardice you mean, either you hold principles about the rights of human beings or you don’t
a war that does not in fact exist or that is even likely
Moral cowardice and appeasement would not stop a war either, at best it will postpone the inevitable and embolden nutters like the Iranian president
I don’t believe you denounce Islam or the behaviour of those who follow it, because if you did you would do so consistently.
When I say your comments are telling I am referring to you in particular and not the left in general.
Actually Iain I don’t think the left is silent on human rights abuses.
It’s certainly more vocal on the human rights abuses committed in Gitmo than the right is for instance…
PKD
my point is actually supported by your comment because as I originally said the left is very keen to denounce human rights abuses when they can Blame the USA.
I also denounce FGM in this post. While I have not written an entire post on the subject search through my 1208 posts and you will find that I consistently denounce FGM where it is mentioned.
You mention it in passing and call it “primitive”, a pretty weak denunciation. I suspect if you’re mythical leftists produced something similar about Iranian fundamentalism you’d say it was piss weak and not making much of a stand at all. But we all know you judge yourself and your mates far differently than you judge the targets of your taunting.
my point is actually supported by your comment because as I originally said the left is very keen to denounce human rights abuses when they can Blame the USA.
Not really. In my experience its the left that has protested against rights abuses by China much more than the right has. In fact China has been allowed to flourish by the Right, especially since being granted WTO membership under the watch of the *right-wing* Bush administration.
Good job that, in about another 10-20 years we’ll all be econonmically subservient to a dictatorship – thanks right wingers!
Iain – do you have a learning disability or something?
How it is not clear to you that there’s a difference between supporting human rights, and choosing the correct forum in which to openly advocate for those rights? Your declaration that my reluctance to denounce Iran’s human rights violations on your forum somehow proves that I don’t support human rights is mind-bogglingly simplistic.
Moral cowardice and appeasement would not stop a war either, at best it will postpone the inevitable and embolden nutters like the Iranian president
How does this have anything to do with what I said, or even anything to do with reality? Iran is not threatening war – the Bush Administration is. What is the ‘inevitable’ to which you are referring in your above comment – is it war with Iran?
If that is what you meant then it’s a pretty big turnaround from your comment two posts earlier when you declared that war with Iran “isn’t even likely”.
I don’t believe you denounce Islam or the behaviour of those who follow it, because if you did you would do so consistently.
Well this barely requires a response. The total illogic of your statement doesn’t need any rebutting.
When I say your comments are telling I am referring to you in particular and not the left in general.
Except that you quite clearly DID refer to the Left in general – well, the ‘far Left’ at least: the fact that you can’t even bring your self to even denounce the excesses of any follower of Mohammed is very telling for you and most of the far left
Seriously Iain – this is becoming silly. Your recalcitrance is once again leading you to make arguments that are irrational and contradictory.
And you must be very timorous indeed if you think that you would be in trouble if you do offer support for Iranian human rights at my humble blog. As i said you are just being cowardly on this one.
Moral cowardice and appeasement would not stop a war either, at best it will postpone the inevitable and embolden nutters like the Iranian president
Utter bollocks! stating that they wish to wipe Israel of the map, seeking to acquire nuclear weapons, the recent tests of the means to deliver the A bombs, they export funds and munitions to Iraq, Hmm Are you sure they don’t want war? Why are they posturing as if they do?
I was of course thinking of the Neville Chamberlain experience before WW2
You dodge the question, precisely where have you been critical of either Islam in general or any of it’s followers in particular because in all the years that I have known you I have seen NO evidence of this at all.Your response is a wonderful example of double think.
Seems to me that my comment was directed at you in particular and any reference to your fellow travellers is mearely an after thought.
Do you even understand the meaning of “recalcitrance” Mondo because from the above I don’t think so.